Hi all,

As you are likely aware of, we're in the final stages of coding in attack throttling to make it take a little longer to kill countries. This is a response to concerns on the other one-country servers but could impact FFA as well. I've talked to a number of FFA'ers and the opinion seems to be that attack throttling shouldn't apply as heavily to FFA. I'm hoping to gauge the opinion surrounding this.

The way this throttling would work would be through increasing the readiness needed to make an attack based on how quickly you attack. The formula we are considering in general is as follows:

normal_readiness + (3-seconds_from_last_attack)

This means if you're spam hitting (more than once per second), you will lose an additional 3% readiness. If you wait 2 seconds, you will lose an additional 1% readiness. If you wait 3 or more seconds you will only lose the normal amount of readiness.

We're thinking that if it is true folks here don't want to have their attacks throttled as much, we can figure out a good amount to throttle it.

Any thoughts? :)

jesus, one hit per 3 secconds? that would make solo kills last atleast 10 minutes.

i am not a fan of that at all. you could kill faster than that before the attack change.

Yeah I pretty much agree with ford. I'm okay with 'throttling' speeds a little bit but that's too much. What about something like if you do 10 attacks in less than 10 seconds it brings you do a screen saying "Your military needs to rest, please wait 10 seconds" then you can start attacking again or something.

hmm.

I will lobby to lower the readiness losses, that befalls the lemming!! :O) This sounds like a better place to concentrate, from my current war position.. :P

You're example would sure help a member to have some better success at walling. Other than this, Why would you wanna de-throttle the attack speeds?

Sorry to veer from the topic.
On a separate note..

This set has been the worst ever, for suiciders, from little tags, untags, and even fake tags, on seemingly everyone.. Ankle biting little yappers.. Police need to run little countries and stay small to deal with those hitting warring clans. No incentive in that, really..

Love yer show, Pang!

The whole idea of making this game more complicated to play (ie: adding throttling to hitting) is a huge turn-off to me. I hope this is insightful.

16 tabs and switching between them for every hit wouldnt be too difficult would it?

this only applies to single countries not your string right Pang?

normal_readiness + (2-seconds_from_last_attack*2) is something i would like better.

This would cap it at 1 second per hit without reduced readiness and it would give demo's the option to spam attacks as fast as they wanted without any additional penalty.

3 is insanely long and whoever decided on that one needs to eat a soggy bowl of cornflakes for a week straight to understand how bad that idea was. just half a second should be plenty of time in between hits

yes tin that would be a huge pain in the ass switching like that

this is going to make killing stuff impossible. 3 seconds per hit means 4 people hitting the same target at 1 hit per 3 seconds will take 2.5m

thats just stupid.

i think hitting on FFA is fine, i have never had a problem walling. not everyone knows how to hit stupid fast still apparently.

I am 100% against that change. For random killing of suiciders and stuff it would be fine but in a large war it would make playing all your turns take foreeeeevvveeerrr! With 16 countries even if you lose one super fast you still have 15 left that you can get on and wall with unlike 1a where you are 1 and done.

WordX2

I personally dont like the idea for FFA. For 1a possibly, but are we supposed to sit there and count to three before we attack again? If anything maybe limit the ability to hit to one second/one attack in 1a but I think FFA should be left alone.

normal_readiness + (1-seconds_from_last_attack)

That's better

Do we have to count to 3??? Cause thats stupid and annoying.

Is there going to be a timer that counts to 3 for us? What if i click 0.1 seconds to soon?

This isnt too bad for alliance, as long as there is some kind of counting system for us. But do not implement it in FFA

I think Havocs idea is better. Atleast then u can spam then wait, then spam then wait. Allows rushing and stuff still. But slows it over time.

Also means in FFA u can use 3 countries to break at close to fulll speed. Rather than hitting once on each country as thats annoying as slow as and completely stop me from playing ffa.

Making it 3 seconds per attack is a little bit extreme. Limiting a country to 10 attacks per 10 seconds (per Havoc's suggestion) would be a better way I think, as it would force them to at least switch countries to hit rapidly. Solo kills would still be very possible under that situation.

this is the single worst idea i've ever heard of

i think i'd honestly stop playing normally and just suicide for fun instead

i've made 113,580 attacks in just this server

instead of taking me idk on average lets say i made 4 hits/second. i hit quick, you all know that. 113580/4 / 60 / 60 = thats ~8 hours of hitting in pure spamming hits that i've spent warring in about half the sets here in FFA

now imagine i had to wait 3 seconds, which in reality to optimize i'd count out to 4 in my head, that would take.... 113580 * 4 / 60 / 60 / 24.... over 5 days of my time to make that # of hits.

thats completely fluffed up you'd even think of making this change

this sucks for me hitting at 15 hits a sec this is BS
you are fixing something that will drive people away


but its your game i might have to quit FFA

what good would even come from this other than pissing every single person off? since not a single post here has been positive as of yet...

walling is freaking easy in this game, theres not a server on here i haven't been able to wall countries on, except for when i have to type in that fluffing captcha in order to login to wall. and yes that happened to me after you supposedly "changed it" so that if you're being hit you don't need a captcha

all this would change is make it easier for larger clans to kill fast, and penalize smaller clans for not having more members

if you have 100 members, you can kill a country in 9 seconds.

if you have 1 member, it would take a few minutes

how in the world is that good for the game to penalize the little guy?

hmmmm

normal_readiness + (3-seconds_from_last_attack)

is certainly too much, even for alliance/team

why not

normal_readiness + (2-seconds_from_last_attack), but also change medical tech so it will help with military loses while defending as well?

This is a very bad idea for FFA. I have mixed feelings about 1a though. 3 seconds is definitely too long of a wait.

i would Probably end up leaving ffa for sure if not the game. this game takes the upmost time that i will let it as is. if its gonna take me that long to kill its not worth

In some ways I hate not being able to wall, but this is FFA, we all have 16 countries.

And I would hate to lose extra readiness. If you had to implement this I'd rather it just stop me from attacking....like it stops you if you don't have enough oil.

This has no benefit to FFA and would most likely drive me from the game. Because I like FFA the best.

I do play alliance and team too, and even there I don't think this is needed. With alert bots and smart phones, it's so much easier to wall. I would say an attack per second is pretty fair. (for alliance and team server)

what i can say will not do what i am thinking so i will refer to this...

http://youtu.be/31g0YE61PLQ

Pang, admin should focus on adding features that would make KRs more friendly other than joining IRC. This kind of add ons on the game does not attact new players. Admins should focus on things that would attract new players

anyone considered a hybrid solution?

normally min readiness loss is 7%, with a max of 18%

stays at min 7% for dh but goes up to 27% max

what if when inside the throttled limit on ffa you got +1% effective not +1% minimum

in other words if you didnt wait 1 second between hits it would start you off at 3% loss so you would be able to send 4/18 of mil max instead of 7/18 while maintaining minimum readiness loss

in percentage terms that drops you from being able to break with 38% of your military to 22% of your military if you want to be able to break fast

i propose that mainly because i like proposing interesting solutions but when you factor in changes to walling and potential changes to expected hits/day or hits:kill it makes it less important to hit fast in servers where you have 1/16 of the countries you do in ffa

since we kill too many countries too quickly at the moment even with some slowdown in killing in ffa if you reduced readiness regained to 2% that would reduce hits you needed to do by 33% and save everyone time, you can tune hits/kill as much as you like

could even reduce readiness more as well as making the readiness penalty harsher but over a smaller timespan to still throttle hits but over a smaller timespan

how about work on strats the Autostrats in game are lame
do something to make us happy gain hehe

Don't change. It destroys the game. Don't even make a small change like suggested. Things are good the way they are.

seriously, with 16 countries i beg of you to not change FFAs attacking. if you must seriously dont make it 3 seconds per attack. i only play the FFA server as it is, anf if its 3 seconds per attack i will no longer play. tyhat would add an unjust burden on someone that already has to open 16 tabs to attack promptly, and it will make the game unplayable.

i can understand the alliance server babies complaining about 3 minute kills, but on FFA that is what makes wars fun.

i know im only a patron, but at least heed my words of pleading. thanks.

a button where you could program it to attack once every 3 seconds for xx times would be interisting, that way you could tell all your 16 countries to do it if you wanted to

would take about 1 minute to kill that way with less button presses

edit: auto stop if DH

Why are some of you fluffing about the fact that an idea was presented to you for feedback? Some of you act like spoiled children.

Slag... i don't think this idea was very well thought out. 95% of the people dont like it for quite a number of reasons. Perhaps if it was an idea that had some positive impact rather than just a pure restriction on players it might have been received differently.

what about an ffa rule that you can reduce a country to below 0 pop and unless it gets its pop back above 0 within 3 minutes of dying its permadead

that way you can hit superfast and people can still wall

Troll

Sorry Slag, I guess people get the feeling it is something going to be implemented, just by looking at the first line of the thread.




I am also against the idea. My reasons have been already stated above in other posts. We get 16 lives, who cares if you lose 1 before you get to wall.

Thanks for bringing the idea to FFAT before implementing it Pang :)

Appreciate it.

Killing my work study for 2 month...change the script again ...anyway look better then before :)

What's wrong with waiting for April the first? I mean, this has to be a joke right?

I'm so far from understanding formulas and such, that I don't know if the walling is factored in, to counter these latest improvements in speed killing.
'Walling is easy?' 9 times out of ten, though you may have caused the opponent to use an amazing amount of turns to kill you, you still wind up... dead.. It made it tougher, to wall if you ask me.. But I think it's about the only benefit..

I gotta read through Enshula's post 4 or 5 more times to perhaps understand what he's actually saying, for sure.. Even then, it may not sink in..
But reading it once made me think he's on the right track. And shows me he's thinking outside the box. (I am barely able to think inside this particular box.) :P

It's very cool, to be able to help shape the game, even by the most ignorant people, (math wisdom wise), can still offer their ideas..

I'm not for the 3 second thing, but let's think on how to make it more challenging to kill without losing the speed that's enjoyed now, of getting one dead.. Many barely have time to pop in and dump their ordinance, as it is..

So, let's don't say fluff this, I'm out of here, if bullfluff!.... If this is done, WTF have you contributed? Nothing~!

Come on man! Let's brainstorm this fluff and put the minds of the smart, and the minds that are smart asses together, and let's just add more possible aspects to the mix to help balance it out so we can continue having fun..

I gotta say.. It is disappointing, to hear this reaction from some here.. Let's not fear what we don't understand. Or, create a negative feeling. Amazing, how very smart people can be so unbelievably stupid!

We have a lot of very smart individuals who are in concert improving the game. We also have a lot of people who are smart, that play this game.
Personally, I am at a disadvantage because I'm not as smart as most who are successful at doing well playing. In NBK we have some of the best players on the server.. I go to the these guys and hit them up for info that I would never be able to figure out.. Why? Because we are a team.. And help each other to collectively be one of the best crews in the FFA.. I'm not ashamed to admit I'm not sophisticated enough to write my own strats. I can't.

One of our crew, suggests, They (Pang & co.) should add oil selling to the private market. And make oil able to be FA'd

This throttle thing may have taken a fluffload of time creating it.. Only to have it go over like a lead fart.. So, the builders are allowed to temporarily doom and gloom.. Like... Slagpit! Neener neener! ;o)

Have a little faith, and all will be better...

*as Forrest Gump* That's all I got to say, about that...

From reading this thread it doesn't seem like the general consensus is "for" this idea, at least not how it's being presented. If we are to change the way killing is done I feel we should look at alternatives to losing additional readiness.



I like this idea, possibly tweaked just a little... A country would have to die at some point without the possibility of coming back or one could just get online, wait till dead and roll a few turns to regain pop. Die again, roll turns, rinse and repeat. How about you can kill, and the country has one attempt at resurrection within 3 minutes and the second time population is brought to zero its permadead.

Or another idea to "slow" things down without changing readiness or disallowing "fast" attacking would be to ditch the attack again button. Forcing the attacking country to reconfirm the attack every hit could slow things down just a little bit and prevent "spam" attacks.

^^ Sounds pretty cool.

If you wait 3 or more seconds you will only lose the normal amount of readiness.
====================
If we try the % you suggest, ya should make it, a lot less than normal readiness losses.. None, would be good! We could call it 'Snail speed killing'. for those basically too lazy to go through the clicks needed to quickly rebuild readiness..

I don't understand frankly, why the one country servers are needing this implementation...

the only think i have to add is maybe a way to tie in med tech, make it worth something more then a way to transfer money and buy-outs

GOD no

This change isn't needed in FFA, in FFA players have 16 countries so is VERY unlikely that people will find themselves with all of them dead.

Alliance and Team are different because we only have a single country there and making it a little harder to kill would be nice.

I believe someone said that medical tech can be changed to reduce civilian loses during Kill runs, and let's be honest if a country with medical tech will eat 20% more hits, well that helps.

i really do think modifying med tech will be enough.

I wrote that last night and fell sleep before posting it :o

Also having the chance to save your country is one of the changes I would like, why not make it that once a country is killed/deleted this country will start to lose 14% of everything per turn(like a change of government) that would allow others to farm self deleted countries and dead countries; giving a netting aproach to war.

also killed countries should lose 100% of their money on hand and 100% of their goods on the market.

i've been following along in this thread, but not wanting to stay too involved :p

i will add one thing:
if you have javascript turned on, there is a small countdown on the page that disappears when it's safe to attack again with minimum readiness loss.
for non-javascript users, they get the message but it doesn't count down