I Smell WAR!

you mean you can't hold 20k land on 1 mil turr anymore?

bottom feeding is so yesterday

entitlement.

that is the problem, same problem with why the game was dying.

everyone thinks they are entitled to something, like crappy WoW players think they should be playing the end game, so they fluff and moan until the admins makes the game cheesewalk.

everyone else signs pacts, why does PDM expect another alliance to simply GIVE you a DNH at the start of a reset with out confirmation, there are pacts that are signed that says it's auto renewed, but in this situation, looks like it isn't it.

PDM thinks they are entitled to respect, to be able to do anything they want, including using special attacks, missiles, and harmful spyops to 'retaliate' against other alliances.

Entitlement,

again, like ZIP mentioned, this is a war game, it's not hug the trees until the cows come home game. If you want to survive, you have to be able to retal (with SS/PS) and hold your land.

if you want to run around with 300k turrets with 20k land, and your alliance isn't pacted out with everyone on the server, then it's your fault. sure, having 3m turrets would increase your expenses, but guess what, you aren't a prime target.


Alliance earns respect, and for others to leave them alone, they have to show that they can retal. Look at WoF, they are doing very fine.

Instead, PDM whines and fluffes, does their stupid stunts, and then when they can't take it anymore, kills a country and comes to AT crying.

Wait, when have we heard this before? Oh right, PDM does this every couple reset.

Ever since Comwood and his attempt at botting, PDM sure seems like they will do anything and everything to get what they want.
And ignoring what's generally accepted and what's not.

Sounds like terrorism to me.



And before you guys point out 17 in 24 again, 17 in 24 is still land grabbing, not missile/AB/steal tech and finally, killing a country (which, is a declaration of war)



Jelly
AT observer.

Again, long winded BS.

You hit them 17 times in a day. It was obviously coordinated and is a clear sign of war. There is no real defending that action, and if you get hit then you asked for it.

sure doesn't look like it's coordinated in the news to me.

but I can't see inside LaF, I guess dagga can because he's so sure of it

PDM, i like your retal policy on the part of country:country L:L. it is nice if i get grabbed by you, but i would think it would really suck for you because they can't come out ahead in lging other tags. don't like the special ops as retals though, how do you keep track of those?? they are not in the news and if you look at news it looks one sided.

laf. lol, you always have done excessive grabbing then jumping out of range to overwhelm the little guys. you constantly did it to Neofed every reset, then wanted to appease us with a DNH.

hanlong, as noted previously our FA is travelling, hence the forum messages i've been sending you and enshula. you could reply to those instead of saying over and over that we aren't talking.

i'd really like for you to clarify whether or not you truly believe that the farming you did was an appropriate response to the two grabs we did on you, which we contacted you about, and which you retalled. i think you should be able to agree that your actions absolutely set the tone for the current situation we're in. you said as much in earlier threads when we were whining about being farmed by you.

you don't even have to clarify that on AT. just send me a message.

When you do harmful spy ops on countries that have never attacked PDM, are those pre-emptive retals? How does that fit into PDM's retal policy?

No, that is absolutely against our policy and would be dealt with accordingly. I assert that #394 did no such thing, and I've seen no evidence to counter that, despite my request for such evidence.

Since you won't supply any evidence, we're asking our members if anyone went rogue and did unauthorized harmful ops on LaF. All I know right now is that the target you guys farmed relentlessly (394), the guy this thread is about, did not do harmful ops on LaF.


Spin, spin, spin, though.

both LaF and PDM are ghey....you farm alliances who are smaller then you, you have a land:land policy(laf) while your members like to top feed....

LaF doesnt overwhelm peoples retal capacity by hitting them, laf techers start out of range of retals and remain out of range of retals... thats how landgrabbing is supposed to be done if you want to run a good country. Anyone that thinks otherwise is a moron.

And since when does laf topfeed? laf bottom/mid feeds heh...

What about what PDM has been doing to sanct so far?

This is why you don't get respect.

Funny, a lot of LaF techers have been successfully retalled.

well then they fail

True story ;)

Although being out of range of retals only works vs some clans :P

laf topfed me this set =p

they top fed me too...:) but its ok whatchu gonna do

well.. the numerical #s are a bit misleading because 20 of the 22 hits from #118 were for 91 acres, so ya.. its 22hits but at 91 acres is not very much land. I also think your counting wrong. It would be (20*91)+(2*135) = 2090 acres, which means that 594 came out ahead by almost 1,000 acres because of the ghost. Seems like a win to me!

C/P from other thread- Perhaps it'll be seen in this one :/


Detmer can correct me if I'm wrong here, but I think what he means is being mistaken.

Our last two sets where we were pacted to Laf were in the interest of friendship, or at least starting to repair our very hostile history.

When our two countries landgrabbed Laf earlier this set Laf was on DNH, we didn't know if Laf had us on DNH and it wasn't that important. Laf took the retals and profited from it. We had no quarrels with that, as we believed we were in the wrong for those two countries breaking the DNH with Laf that we imposed on our end.

Laf took those two landgrabs as evidence that we were open for landgrabbing. This wouldn't have been a problem, we would have taken you guys off DNH and treated you like LCN,ICN,Sanc, and any other non-pacted, non-hostile alliance. Basically landtrading in the normal LG ---> Retal way.

We don't contact ICN,LCN,Sanct and the rest and ask them if it would be ok to have a normal non-pacted landgrab ---> Retal relationship with them. No massive farming, just normal landgrabbing is a given between two non-hostile non-pacted alliances.

This is where Laf is different. When our countries did those two grabs on you and you retalled you decided we were open for grabbing. That's fine, but you went ahead and took 17 hits in 24 hours on PDM. That is not the landgrabbing action of a friendly un-pacted alliance.

I suppose maybe it was our error to assume that after the last two pacted sets the Laf:PDM relations had been repaired enough that we could treat each other with respect in terms of landgrabbing in the event that we go unpacted :/


It's regularly noted by Laf members that PDM started it with those two landgrabs, and you are correct. Laf retalled them and opened us up for landgrabbing (Which is ok). However, I still haven't seen an explanation as to why LAF took those 17 hits in 24 hours right after we became open for landgrabbing. Why mass farm us from the word go?

Examining a bit farther there.

#519 5-taps within 25 hours
#388 4-taps within 24 hours
#443 4-taps within 24 hours
#598 2-taps within 26 hours
4 counries single landgrab
2 countries retal PDM's 2 landgrabs

In the same timeframe there are

2 - PDM landgrabs (Initial hits between PDM & Laf)
2 - PDM retals - single hit retals

Those are the first 25 landgrabs between PDM and Laf all set

That my friend is not respectable landgrabbing, and unfortunately shows us the very very low level of respect Laf holds for PDM even after our 2 sets of pacting each other in the interest of a better future.

Why mass farm from the word go?

noobs

so much for hanlong's "oh you should have just contacted me, i'm so reasonable" song and dance.

stop crying and kill each other already!

huh? what's going on?

hi

LAF declaring war over retals? Never have I seen this sort of behavior before... Not even when we were FS'd in RAGE twice. I can never see LAF using something like this to ones advantage.

Spaced , ya hurt me :'(

LaF has repeatedly pushed this form of behaviour on multiple alliances.

It covers the fact they can't compete with Omega and Evo without farming alliances into the ground.

They have a deliberatly manipulative "topfeed" policy, which turns any beneficial mid-feed situation where countries could mutually benefit into an abusive relationship.

Their grabbing practices are not based on fostering grabbing between alliances, but instead on abusive bottom-feeding/lower-mid-feeding with a 1-sided relationship.

Whilst they pursue these policies, they will continue to be suicided, to be derided in the forums, and to be scorned by other netgaining alliances, warring alliances and smaller clans alike. The more they post, the worse their reputation gets too.

What is amusing is that whilst LaF are busy farming PDM and the like, SoF is busy completly dominating the server and taking control of the game.

p.s. a couple of those laf countries do look good for top 10 this set but!

lafs manipulative topfeed policy is 80% l:l not counting ghost acres

dont some others do 90 or even 100?

true story. FIRE ROR'd me, and by our policy I could only do 80% L:L I hit 84.9% in two hits but by THEIR policy I could take 150% land...

I took an extra hit for like 120% land could have done 1 or two more but let it slide.

that is NOT laf's policy.

laf's policy is if the RETALLER doesn't get 80% land back on the first hit.

So country A could hit country B, both 15k acres, country A gets good land on hit.

LaF will retal with country C, who is twice the size, who only takes 60% of land off retal, so can then retal again to get another 60% to get 120%, instead of B hitting and getting 100% back.

Ironically i think PDM's country:country L:L only policy solves this issue.

LaF have improved their policy over the last year or so though i will say.

You might be right on other clans' policies though enshula.

Want a medal LT? jesus get a grip on life lol.

I have a great grip on life thanks :-)

You all sound like women.

There's a problem.


nagnagnagnagnagnagnagnagnagnagnagnagnagnagnagnagnag
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And then some!


And in the end nobody does anything. :-P

^ We just coordinated a chat to take 160 of our several hundred(maybe thousand?) retals.

Thats doing something Makinso :-p and shush or else I won't leech you more tech in team next set, I'll play farmer or something! :-p

we dont think through who takes what retal that much

anyway even if 2 grabs for about 79 and 79 for 158 total

the country that grabbed will usually get 147

thats not that big a difference and the reason the next retal threshold is below 100 is tro try and balance it out a bit between who gains and loses in what situations

ya DL you are fluffing nuts. When someone opens a retal it's first come first serve. Like 10 minutes reserve is all you get.. some of us camp the boards for retals...

You don't m ow what you are talking about DL, but for a guy that seems to hat laf so much you are sure giving us a lot of credit

btw get ur ass online h4 ;)

lol makinso, you just want to see war =) not everyone is like SOL and wars over everything you know ;)

Nothing I can do with no money

:D

Kill PDM. Simple!

Kill PDM because LaF farmed us? Makes great sense...

lol ok then h4, PDM will continue to make you a parking lot then ;P

how much does it cost to park at one of your spots h4? ;)

i want to see a 15k acre landkill please.

keep spinning LaF :)
just waiting on full turns to return your friendly farm of my country.
So long as I make back 13-14k acres + ghost acres, I am apparently taking L:L by LaF's own retal policy. Just like they took from #594.

oh and for anyone trying to claim I was on 20k acres with 300k, I was sitting on 14k with 1.5 million, and climbing. The LaF'er I grabbed by accident at the start of the set was sitting on like 10k with a 10k ss break...

go drow =)

think of all the ghost acres we are generating for each other!

it's win win!

just don't send nukes, you have to understand its lose-lose since you are destroying good acres for no reason :(

meh, I've never been a fan of nukes. as you say, very wasteful.
it's land I could farm.
and I believe I may be getting old, I am mellowing towards LaF. I am still going to farm you back, no doubts of it, but without any malice and much amusement.
Han: shame we had to run into each other under circumstances like this