Confirmed

Correct. It is me. Any netting tags with spots?

Are netting tags even a thing on this server?... it looks very feisty :)

I'd agree it's different as CI, I haven't run it much on express but doing so last reset I could see a lot of ways that it could be done much better than I did it even if you ignore the atrocious grabbing ;)

OK first reset back in a while. What's the market like?

I hear it's rubbish. I have this crazy idea that maybe rainbow will work...

Hahahahahah

GL with that ;)

Somebody else's turn to grab I think ;)

ok cool thanks!

Slight change of plan this reset then :)

I thought I read somewhere that losing bonus (e.g build cost reduction, expense, resource decay etc) on govt switch would be removed?

I tested on Alpha and you still lose it :(

Did I imagine this?

boners

As much as I don’t like this, it’s the axact thing I think is needed. The fact I don’t like it is what makes me think it’s essential.

I think back to a kid and finding cheat mode in old games and thinking it was great, but in reality it spoils the game. Something you only realise when you are older.

It’s the danger that makes for the fun. Without any danger there is no risk/reward. It’s purely formulaic, and as much as I like the min/maxing optimisation (my favourite kind of games) the element of chance is crucial. It feels like express (as in alliance) had drifted a little too far one way.

I think 360/360 was right in terms of allowing players not to fall behind (720 total was fair if you e.g missed a day).

I liked that it made it *just* possible to do a kill. (I like GDI stopped 1:Kill policies)

I don’t like that 360 on hand makes it too easy to retal.

I think dropping turns on hand would work but maybe do 240(420) or something? (Ie same number of maxed turns but can’t play so many at once. Perhaps give 2 stored turns per turn back?

Or going to the extreme allow eg 120(600) so it’s more like the other servers in terms of how much you can do in a single “day” of turns and give stored turns back 5 at a time?

You still don’t lose turns (no more than before).

Getting 6 turns per turn (1 + up to 5 stored) would be fast like it would be in line with the pace of an express server but without some of the more extreme effects of a single country being able to play too many turns all at once?

The irony is I quit liked “peacefully” farming bots without being hit back.

Yeah I spied, if I am gonna grab a player I am going to make sure I don't bounce!!!

I wasn't grabbing strategically, more to create a little action.

I've sucked up some big retals and fair play, they are justified, all in good sport :)

Back in the day you used to have to try balance defence or you risked top-feeds from players that weren't grabbing smartly (as I am demonstrating now!). As much is it was annoying to get grabbed it was usually OK cos you got more back in the retal. The problems came when people double tapped or RoR. Thats not very sporting in my book, and I think the way GDI works is perfect for deterring that kind of thing :)

What I am seeing now though is what's going on in Alliance. People are running little to no defense, and just expecting to free ride. That should be a risky bet, maybe when bots tart attacking that will shake things up, in the meantime maybe the prospect of a wildcard player that grabs humans will do the job. I'm trying not to hit anyone more than once (thats asking for war!) and you all got a good chance to retal (especially as CI is getting hammered this set so I can't even grow properly!)

There are a bunch of players I have passed up on due to them having defence, I even messaged them to praise them that they dodged a grab because of it.

Maybe nothing will change, but its a bit of spice eh?



Application accepted :D

lol, sorry I didn't even register it was you who had messaged me :)

nice retal!

Ggs!

2024-04-26 10:57:26 PS The Great One (#92) UgolinoII (#2) 1064A (1504A)
2024-04-26 06:53:54 PS UgolinoII (#2) The Great One (#92) 541A (791A)

Time to mix things up, I realise I will never net in peace but hey ho, it’ll be like primary but with bots :D

LG policy:

I accept 1:1 retals

Anything else and we spin the wheel :)

None of this is personal <3

Oh boy

Haha that express country is nuts.

Thanks for that link I am going to read it now.

I'm sure he knows it was within the spirit of testing thoroughly :D

I'm deep undercover now...

Quite the restart bonus!

0.2 mins ago
You were given a daily bonus of 20 extra acres.

0.2 mins ago
2,641,253 survivors emerge from the ruins of your previously destroyed country and begin to rebuild. They hold true to the values of the former regime (bonus points) and are ready for you to lead them once more! The survivors were able to salvage:
329,825 acres
804 Construction Sites
$2,147,483,647
2,818,913 Technology
326,767 Buildings
1,150,095 Units

Hmm would have been interesting to run my bots at that time see how they did, last time I ran was October 2019.

I changed the code so much that I think it would be difficult to remerge from qzjul's master

Although, having had a quick look over, it looks like he mostly added things in different places as I had refactored out a lot of my code for "bot strategy"

They all inherited from a core Strategy class that established wether it was possible to do something, whether they should do it, and then decided if they would do it, then did it!

Each Strat effectively became setting a land goal, build goals and tech goals then running a turn based on logic ie for Rainbow it was:

if ($this->willSendStockToMarket()) { return PublicMarket::sellFood($this->c,true); }
if ($this->willSellMilitary()) { return PublicMarket::sell_max_military($this->c); }
if ($this->willSellTech()) { return PublicMarket::sell_max_tech($this->c); }
if ($this->willSellFood()) { return PublicMarket::sellFood($this->c,$this->stockpiling()); }
if ($this->willSellOil()) { return PublicMarket::sell_oil($this->c,$this->stockpiling()); }
if ($this->willBuildCS()) { return Build::cs(); }
if ($this->willBuildFullBPT()) { return Build::buildings($this->buildings()); }
if ($this->willExplore()) { return explore($this->c); }
if ($this->willCash()) { return cash($this->c); }
if ($this->c->canExplore()) { return explore($this->c); }

Other strats did/didn't do some of those steps (e.g an indy wouldn't sell food, a techer would tech when it was right)

They all prioritiesed their goals, stocked/destocked when the time was right,& bought mil & tech sensibly according to their priorities.

I also had a FFO, so that their was an oil market and they would stock oil for destock too (without land dropping).

LOL

My bot repo:

This branch is 120 commits ahead of, 345 commits behind

Looks like a lot changed though! :)

https://www.earthempires.com/ai/954/ranks

This was about where I was at...

https://www.earthempires.com/ai/696/ranks/97

These bots run by you looked superior to the default ones...

https://www.earthempires.com/ai/889/ranks

As much as I love easy bot farming being able to hit multiple targets with <10k turrets, at this stage in the set that seems weird (unless i'm not remembering right). It used to be that you'd get a few easy hits out of the gate but after that they seemed to grow so you could generally just about keep up with hitting them (especially when they had D allies!)

That makes me feel like something has changed where they aren't buying as much stuff as they used to? Do they need to buy more?

or, maybe add more bots to increase demand? (or indirectly through players growing bigger and buying more tech/military to grow?)

I hacked up some bot code a few years back that consistently took the majority of t10 on the AI server ;)

Well, not to a bot country...

Just testing :) Promise I won't do it again x

1st kill ;)

cos bots are dumb and undercut all the time!

Hardest thing about CI is not being able to play turns whenever you want heh

I am :)

(kind of)

On the old days I won with Theo casher, but the stars had to align just right.

Most of my best finishes are techer.

Since seeing the buff on expenses for CI it looks like that might be viable... we'll see

I think there is a fine line between what is considered working together and what is not, who was it lets have a look...

I also don't remember having allies before, but now that we do then that line is getting blurrier. What if your D ally is getting beat up?

Having def allies might usher in a new era in express, who knows ;)

That sentence was too long so I asked ChatGPT to summarise it:

Don't be a fluff.

Interesting, so I am thinking this is going to slow down the hardcore farming a bit...

Sorry if this is a silly question, but does this mean that if you send 100 jets, then you lose 99 jets.

(Ignoring med tech & govt bonus)

Boys and their toys :)

to clarify. efficiency = fun for some people

That isn't to say I won't throw all that out the window to retal/war when necessary :)

Everyone says things like farming bots is no fun, no skill needed, etc

Thats true to some extent (80/20 rule). Getting t10 is easy enough with zero effort bot grabbing and no fancy stuff, and that's mild fun for old timers short on time e.g me.

When I used to play a few years back some people seemed to have beef and would grab you every set, regardless of defence, so that wasn't the solution. There was no point putting time in. So I just started playing under my name and spending no effort on a country so people could grab me if they wanted, and I would just retal. That way I can't be trolled with grabs. If I manage to get through a set without being hit then I might get a lucky finish, if not then another reset will be along shortly :)

seconded

CHALLENGE ACCEPTED

Man, getting t10 is harder than I remember :)

The quad tap:

2024-04-19 04:44:21 SS Elfame (#92) Free Bird (#35) 456A (641A)
2024-04-19 04:44:10 SS Elfame (#92) Free Bird (#35) 610A (844A)
2024-04-19 04:44:04 SS Elfame (#92) Free Bird (#35) 710A (955A)
2024-04-19 04:43:55 SS Elfame (#92) Free Bird (#35) 829A (1083A)

Grabbed: 2605A (3523A)

The quad-tal:

2024-04-19 22:26:45 SS Free Bird (#35) Elfame (#92) 467A (602A)
2024-04-19 22:25:52 SS Free Bird (#35) Elfame (#92) 623A (836A)
2024-04-19 22:23:20 SS Free Bird (#35) Elfame (#92) 880A (1208A)
2024-04-19 22:22:26 SS Free Bird (#35) Elfame (#92) 1011A (1412A)

Recovered:2981A (4058A)

Net Totals
======

Elfame: +542A
Free Bird: +1453A

Oof

Recall goods?

Most people don't know how to make grabbing another human worthwhile. So they end up getting retalled for more than they grabbed and so they get the face on then RoR and then its war.

If you do know how to make grabbing another human worthwhile then the other guy usually gets the face on and double taps back and then its war.

War is generally fruitless. Possible to get a kill, but if you don't then you just end up in useless back and forth and each player claiming they smashed the other player hardest on the forums.

blah blah

gonna eat a lot of peaches

cc

The round ends in 50.8 hours. - I have spent 16 on Free GDI, and have 11 left. For reference, so I dont know how I fit into that scale.

I don't know why some people would have more/less but I guess if they figure out how to optimise that then more power to them.

I see the bonus have been tweaked but it seems to me that still the only thing really worth doing is turns/booms with it being such a short reset (in terms of days worth of bonus points). Maybe im not being creative enough!?

If you had e.g build cost reduction at -2.3% and 1 point each, that would let a standard 9 points a day(45 in total) get to 100% build cost reduction by last day (similar to alliance) if someone could optimise to get a few points elsewhere too I dont think it would kill things, if someone was a little light because they aren't premium and didn't click well thats on them. The other bonuses could scale relative to the build biff. I dunno, I like trying unusual strats built around different bonus usage. (build cost seems to be the standard in alliance, maybe the others could be buffed? but thats off topic here I guess) anyway thanks for replying appreciate there might be more to it (im a coder, and there usually is when people ask for stuff heh)

Far from 'begrudging' I whole heartedly welcome them!

I think it's better than running the same formulaic netting Strat(s) every round and micro-optimising, keeps things fresh.

I think someone else mentioned this, but for the netters, I'd like to see variance in the govt bonuses. Maybe a random +/-50% on one/some/all of the bonuses. (e.g. +15% Food Production becomes +7.5-30%, -25% max PCI becomes -12.5% to -50%). You could keep the essence of the govts the same.
Some resets particular strats might get lucky and be totally buffed, some resets they might be totally nerfed.

On a superficial level people might flock to the buffed one, but that in itself creates an environment where that Strat starts to become weaker.

If rep PCI got buffed, and fascist oil got nerfed, you might see bunch of rep cashers, and fewer than normal FFO with some interesting market effects, Then if Theo got 100% pop bonus at the same time food is gonna get crazy, as techers try to take advantage of a cash rich market...

Stuff like that. I think that keeps it fresh. Removes pure formulaic approaches, adds a little chaos.

Or if you wanted to get wild you could have an ever changing political background in which global geopolitics churn over time as political interests wax and wane, with the New Earth Order issuing decrees that cause political upheavals, or other such imaginary RP type events that hint at the slightly unpredictable shifting bonuses as the set progresses...

Invisible market forces due to interplanetary trade buying and selling on the public market...

All countries on the server being part of a continental exploration and as server wide total land increases encountering new and powerful bot countries that are added to the scores list as the set progresses, with a penchant for top feeding. No need for suiciders, you have big bots that like to grab fat defenceless countries (and accepts retals... usually!). Does your netting clan take the hit, in order to outgrow other netting clans, or do you proactively kill the bot preventing further grabs but giving other netters an advantage...

Sounds like hell, lets do it!

I played this way one time with a group of other fellows. We netted like maniacs hidden amongst other clans and then once we were massive, we "warred" the entire server, I like to think it created a little splash. Of course people hated me and others for a while, and I paid my penance being beaten down for several sets.

So I do see your point. I like to think we weren't your low brow griefer, after all I was not called "Earle of Grabs II" for nothing! It was only small sideshow in the long history of earth, but for a brief time we were the antogonists that unified the server. There was some actual RPG for once.

That being said...

I know what it's like to be suicided, it sucks and I don't like it any more than the next guy, I doubt I'll ever do it again.

I think these are just the emergent properties of the way the game is set up. Im not sure they can be "fixed" by changing the game.

I like the sound of the new changes, and I think it will be interesting to see what kind new behaviours emerge! Both desirable and undesirable.